Building a Legacy: Mastering Life Beyond the Court with Doug Noll

Brad Knoll: 00:00:00

Welcome to Student of the Game podcast where we help you master the fundamentals, fall in love with practice, and win at the game of life.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:08

I'm your host, Brad Knoll.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:09

Welcome to the classroom.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:13

Welcome back to another episode of Student of the Game.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:16

I'm your host, Brad Knoll and I'm with Doug Knoll, my dad.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:20

Welcome to the show.

Doug Knoll: 00:00:21

Thank you, Brad.

Doug Knoll: 00:00:22

Nice to be here.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:24

So I had to call the coach, that's his hashtag, callthecoach.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:28

And we've got a pretty, pretty fun episode today.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:31

It's fun for me.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:31

So if you don't enjoy this, I'm having fun anyway.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:33

So this is, this might just be for me that we can record this episode of my dad and I having a conversation.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:38

But I think you have a fantastic story.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:41

I think it's a story that a lot of us can see ourselves in and I think it's very appropriate for Student of the Game.

Brad Knoll: 00:00:48

So let's, we're going to talk about you chasing after your passion and your career and then, and then having it being pulled out from underneath you and what you've done since then.

Brad Knoll: 00:01:00

So if you're listening right now and you know you have a goal and you feel like you failed at it or you've tried something and it's been taken away from you, I think there's a greater purpose and that's what we're going to share today.

Brad Knoll: 00:01:12

So why don't you take us back, tell us, tell us a little bit about, you know, your start in Burn, Indiana as a legendary basketball player and tell us what that was like.

Doug Knoll: 00:01:22

Well, in Burn, Indiana, which is about 4,000 people, there's not a whole lot to do back in the 60s and 70s other than play basketball.

Doug Knoll: 00:01:29

So my dad kind of got me started with that playing some semi professional basketball.

Doug Knoll: 00:01:34

And also I think at one point in time he was the last cut from Ball State after he came back from the service.

Doug Knoll: 00:01:41

So that was kind of ingrained in me early and I just kind of had a passion for basketball.

Doug Knoll: 00:01:48

It seemed like it, it fit me and who I was.

Doug Knoll: 00:01:51

I tried football, got hit too hard and so, but basketball was always the sport for me now golf, but, and I played basketball and golf in high school, but loved basketball.

Doug Knoll: 00:02:05

We would, we would play as much as we could till they turned out the lights at the school every night and I was only a block away.

Doug Knoll: 00:02:13

So I played a lot of basketball growing up and obviously wanted to play in college and I did.

Doug Knoll: 00:02:20

So we just continued the journey and it was small town in Indiana and kind of the basketball mecca.

Doug Knoll: 00:02:28

Our town is 4,000, our high school is 400, and our new gym that I got my senior year seated 5,000 people.

Doug Knoll: 00:02:36

And we generally packed it out.

Doug Knoll: 00:02:37

So good weekend nights in Indiana and that's what we had to do.

Brad Knoll: 00:02:44

Well, like they say, and it's just basketball in 49 other states and it's different here.

Brad Knoll: 00:02:49

So for you listening, if you're not in Indiana, we've got a lot of listeners across the pond.

Brad Knoll: 00:02:54

We've got listeners in California and all over.

Brad Knoll: 00:02:57

If you've seen the movie Hoosiers, that's, that's about as close to real life as my dad probably lived is, you know, the caravan of cars driving to the away games.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:06

And you know, it's fun that you're in town right now because Delaney, my middle child, just started her basketball career in high school and so she's got some games this week.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:14

You and Rhonda are in town for.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:16

But that's, that's Indiana for you.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:18

It's basketball.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:19

And you packed the arenas.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:21

And tell us a little bit about your journey.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:23

You went to Division 1 school like most kids, you know, probably got caught up.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:27

You know, you got the attention of a Division 1 school, went to University of Wyoming and that didn't work out.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:31

And then you transferred back to Grace, Grace College here in Winona Lake in Indiana.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:37

But what happened?

Brad Knoll: 00:03:38

We can skip some of the story, but what happened when you came back to Grace?

Brad Knoll: 00:03:41

I heard in two and a half years you were the all time leading scorer.

Brad Knoll: 00:03:44

Well, pretty good career.

Doug Knoll: 00:03:46

Yeah, it was pretty good.

Doug Knoll: 00:03:47

Not quite, but I enjoyed my year at the University of Wyoming and really wasn't ready for Division 1 basketball.

Doug Knoll: 00:03:55

I decided to go back to Grace College in Winona Lake, Warsaw, Indiana.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:00

And Phil Hoskins, who happened to get the coaching job at Grace College recruited me and so I went back to Grace.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:11

I had to sit out my first semester.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:14

That was the rules back then.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:16

I actually should have set out the full year and then had three full years, but I didn't.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:21

And so I started my first games with Grace College out in the Virginia area.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:29

And remember I didn't start my first game and my second game I had 39 points and my third game I had 30.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:38

So it kind of jump started from there.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:41

My career average is somewhere around 27, 28 points a game at Grace College, but only playing two and a half years.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:48

I'm not quite the leading scorer all time at Grace.

Doug Knoll: 00:04:50

I do have some records, free throw and, and those types of things and scoring Per year.

Brad Knoll: 00:04:56

Still to the, still to this day or when you graduated?

Doug Knoll: 00:04:59

Still to this day.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:00

My senior year, I happened to be the third leading scorer in, in the country behind Freeman Williams of Portland State and a guy named Larry Bird that most of you've heard of at Indiana State.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:13

And then I had two years in a row.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:16

The New Orleans Jazz sent our Sid information that if I was a senior, they wanted the information.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:23

And so my senior year they called up and I had a free agent try out in the summer.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:29

Obviously, I wasn't good enough for the NBA, which I knew, but it was a lot of, you know, anticipation, and then I was going to go overseas to play.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:37

But Phil Hoskins had left my senior year and Jim Kessler became my, my coach my senior year.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:43

And Phil called me up and said, I need an assistant coach at Malone College now Malone University in Canton, Ohio.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:51

So I went over there and coached there for a year.

Doug Knoll: 00:05:56

But then the family had a real estate business, and that's really how I got into real estate.

Doug Knoll: 00:06:01

In: 1981

Brad Knoll: 00:06:07

Hold on, time out, Timeout, time out.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:08

This is, this is not a real estate podcast, but I know a lot of Realtors are listening and a lot of Realtors are kind of up in arms with the high interest rates.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:15

But you're saying you started in real estate at 18%?

Doug Knoll: 00:06:18

Yeah, came down from 21 in the, in the late 70s.

Doug Knoll: 00:06:22

And so, you know, I think if you could sell real estate at that point, it's just about any time you could, you could sell real estate and, you know, you would do different things.

Doug Knoll: 00:06:31

House prices had to come down a little bit.

Doug Knoll: 00:06:34

And again, back at that time, you know, we didn't have four and $500,000 houses.

Doug Knoll: 00:06:39

You know, we were selling 30, 50, $60,000 houses.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:42

Yeah.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:43

The average income probably wasn't 50, 60, 70,000 either.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:45

Right.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:45

I mean, there's a trade off to that.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:47

If somebody's listening right now and you're struggling in your business because you can't figure out how to sell something, I think it's important to go back to the fundamentals.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:55

Like this podcast is all about mastering the fundamentals.

Brad Knoll: 00:06:57

And I want to make, I want to make a real estate comment right now.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:02

People move because their lifestyle isn't suitable for the home that they're in or the apartment that they're in anymore.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:09

Right.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:10

People get married and they want their own home.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:12

People have babies, they need a bigger home.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:14

Babies leave and they need to downsize.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:16

There's death, divorce, delinquency.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:18

There's, there's moving.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:19

There's.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:19

The number one reason people are moving today is to get closer to family.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:22

And so what I'm hearing you say is even in 18% interest rate environments, those lifestyle changes created people moving.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:31

There's always opportunity if you see it, you know, and I, I guess.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:36

Sorry to interrupt, but I think that's important to understand.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:38

Hello.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:39

You sold home.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:40

People were still moving at 18%.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:42

And it's because that's, that's what the rate was when their lifestyle changed and needed to buy a home.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:47

Sorry for the shameless real estate plug there.

Doug Knoll: 00:07:49

So.

Brad Knoll: 00:07:50

So back, back to the 80s, you're selling real estate in the family business?

Doug Knoll: 00:07:53

Yeah.

Doug Knoll: 00:07:54

And during the 80s, I ended up owning two real estate companies and two auction companies.

Doug Knoll: 00:08:00

And with the auction company and your grandfather, Maynard, Ms.

Doug Knoll: 00:08:05

Lehman, we would auction off farm ground, farm equipment, we would auction off antiques, collectibles, we would have estate sales.

Doug Knoll: 00:08:15

We auctioned off bowling alleys, we auctioned off daycare centers.

Doug Knoll: 00:08:19

So we were just kind of the general auctioneers of the area.

Doug Knoll: 00:08:25

And I really enjoyed that part of my, part of my life.

Doug Knoll: 00:08:28

But as I grew towards the end of the 80s and you started to play basketball, this is, this is a.

Brad Knoll: 00:08:36

This is a big part of, this is a transition I want everybody to hear.

Brad Knoll: 00:08:38

So the transition comes.

Brad Knoll: 00:08:40

You're in auction, you're doing real estate auctions, you're in the family business, and now there's a transition.

Brad Knoll: 00:08:48

But before we get to that, I just want to give you one opportunity.

Brad Knoll: 00:08:51

We've never had an auctioneer on the podcast, and most people listening have probably never heard an auctioneer.

Brad Knoll: 00:08:57

Are you willing to auction for like 10 seconds?

Doug Knoll: 00:09:01

Yeah, I suppose I could give it a try.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:04

It's been a while, but at 35 and now seven, 40.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:08

At 40, two and a half at a pie.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:09

45.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:10

Seven.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:10

Half an hour 50.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:11

Now 55, now 60.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:12

Here out in the back at 60, now two and a half.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:14

At a high 65, now seven.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:15

A half an hour, $70.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:16

Oh, my gosh, that's a mic drop.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:18

Oh, first time on the podcast we got an auctioneer.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:20

This is unbelievable.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:21

Okay, all right.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:22

Well, I should have, I should have gone 5,000, 10,000 and higher.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:26

I just started with the lower ones.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:28

You're good.

Doug Knoll: 00:09:28

Anyways, it was probably selling some dishware or something like that, so it was a lot of fun.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:34

This is awesome.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:34

If you're driving right now and you just heard an auctioneer coming through your speakers you're probably thinking, what in the world is.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:40

Are we talking about?

Brad Knoll: 00:09:41

But we've got a great podcast with my dad here.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:43

We're going to call the coach.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:44

But why is that important?

Brad Knoll: 00:09:46

Because there's a transition from auction.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:48

You were.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:49

You were auctioning.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:50

You.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:50

You were the.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:51

The number one place, right?

Brad Knoll: 00:09:52

Like.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:53

Like if somebody wanted to sell something, they came to you guys.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:55

You were the best at what you did in the community and around.

Brad Knoll: 00:09:59

And then the.

Brad Knoll: 00:10:00

And then a transition happened.

Brad Knoll: 00:10:01

What happened?

Doug Knoll: 00:10:02

Well, as I mentioned a little bit earlier, the.

Doug Knoll: 00:10:05

You started to grow up and got into the second, third grade where I was coaching you and some other players at South Adams, where we lived in Bern.

Doug Knoll: 00:10:17

And it just kind of clicked to get my.

Doug Knoll: 00:10:20

That desire back to coach again and to be a part of basketball.

Doug Knoll: 00:10:24

And so I actually had an offer from a coach at Indiana Wesleyan University.

Doug Knoll: 00:10:30

I don't even know if I told.

Brad Knoll: 00:10:31

You this, I've never go out there.

Doug Knoll: 00:10:33

But Dave Berline was at Seattle Pacific for a while, came back to Indiana Wesleyan, and I got to know him and he wanted me to be his assistant coach at Indiana Wesleyan.

Doug Knoll: 00:10:47

Well, that was only about 45 minutes from my house.

Doug Knoll: 00:10:50

And I kind of thought if I just stayed in Bern and drove back and forth, I wasn't committed 100%, but I called Jim Kessler up at Grace College and this was late 80s and.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:05

And I asked him if he had any positions open and he said, yeah, but they don't pay.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:11

So I had to talk to, you know, the family and my wife and like, what do you think about this?

Doug Knoll: 00:11:18

I think it's pretty good.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:19

And everybody was like, what?

Doug Knoll: 00:11:21

You're not getting paid?

Doug Knoll: 00:11:22

And I said, well, we'll figure it out.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:24

So right about: 1990

Doug Knoll: 00:11:38

You went in the fourth and fifth grade, I believe it was, to Jefferson.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:43

And it was.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:44

It was funny that I didn't realize at the time that the year before.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:48

And Grace has always been.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:49

Grace College has always been pretty good in basketball.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:51

They won 10 games.

Doug Knoll: 00:11:53

And I never really gave that a thought that, well, they're not very good, but I'm coming up here to coach and so.

Brad Knoll: 00:11:58

For free.

Brad Knoll: 00:11:59

For free.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:00

So, well, kind of for free.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:02

But I've always got some ideas.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:04

Sometimes they don't work out, but other times, sometimes they work out.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:08

And my thought was, why don't I ask them if I could raise money for the athletic department, and then I get a percentage of it.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:16

And so they said, okay.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:18

So I was the development director, and I was the head golf coach for two years and the assistant basketball coach for two years.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:25

And during those two years, I recruited two players from Bernard, Trent Lehman and Ben Fox.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:32

Ben Fox, Yeah.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:33

Thank you.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:34

And both of them helped us win the national championship.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:38

My second year at Grace college, we were 32 and 5.

Doug Knoll: 00:12:41

And that springboarded me to the next phase of my life when we moved out of Warsaw, moved to Spring Harbor, Michigan, and Spring Harbor University.

Brad Knoll: 00:12:50

So what was it like?

Brad Knoll: 00:12:51

So here you are, you're in real estate, the most successful real estate company around, and you get this itch.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:00

One part you left out is we went 10 and, oh.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:02

So our basketball team went 10 and, oh, didn't lose.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:05

So at this point, your coaching record is flawless.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:08

You know, you're batting a thousand percent at this point.

Doug Knoll: 00:13:10

I should have stopped right then, I think.

Doug Knoll: 00:13:12

But.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:14

Well, I think the story is really cool about how, you know, and anybody who knows me knows that, you know, I love goal setting.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:21

I love dreaming, I love achieving.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:23

I love action.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:25

You know, I think big, and I follow my heart, my passion.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:29

And a lot of that comes from, you know, what was modeled, you know, at home, you know, for me, from what you and mom did.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:35

And for you to understand the story now, having kids, it hits a lot different than it did back then, as the kids say.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:44

And so you went there without a promise of a paycheck, of, like, I want this so bad.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:50

I'm willing to come up with ways in which I can make a living by doing what I love.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:55

And I think that's.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:56

For me, that's a lesson that's always stuck.

Brad Knoll: 00:13:58

And if you're out there thinking about, like, you're struggling in your business, I think the first question to ask is, like, are you even passionate about this?

Brad Knoll: 00:14:04

I talk to my team all the time.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:06

Like, nobody on my team.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:08

And I know this for a fact.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:09

Haven't asked them yet, but I know this for a fact.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:11

Nobody on my team grew up saying, I want to be a realtor.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:16

Like, none of them like real estate, just kind of.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:18

You happen to fall into it, but what it can do for you, it provides so many opportunities, but you gotta do something with it.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:25

And I think for me, me, I look at you taking that passion of, like, I want to.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:29

I really want to do this, and I'll just.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:31

I'll figure it out.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:32

And that's.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:33

It's.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:33

It's awesome.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:34

So I want to celebrate that.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:35

So you won a national championship at Grace.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:37

Now all of a sudden, it's like, okay, do I want to do this full time?

Brad Knoll: 00:14:41

Can I do this full time?

Brad Knoll: 00:14:42

You kind of probably got some confidence from being on the staff at Grace, where you won a national title.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:47

You saw what the process was.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:48

You know, we talk about mastering the fundamentals and falling in love with practice.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:51

You know, you made a shooting video to make some money.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:54

I remember rebounding for you.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:56

You know, we don't have to go back to the archives there, but.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:57

But there's a.

Brad Knoll: 00:14:58

There's a VHS out there somewhere where you and I have some shorts hiked up and wearing some Reebok pumps, I think, on a shooting.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:04

On a free throw shooting video.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:05

But then you went to Spring Arbor, had massive success at Spring Arbor.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:09

That's where I kind of say I grew up.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:11

That's my formative years in middle school and high school there.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:13

I'm glad that you took the job at Spring Arbor, because that's where I met Lindsey.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:16

But.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:17

But you had a huge, very successful career.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:20

Why don't you take us to kind of the end of that career when, you know, you get call to come to Fort Wayne.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:25

Yeah.

Brad Knoll: 00:15:25

And a couple calls to come to Fort Wayne.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:27

Yeah.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:28

And if you don't mind real quick, when I went up to Spring harbor, they had not won 10 games in a season in 10 years.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:35

And that was another challenge.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:38

And I remember an interview with seven guys in suits asking me what my goals were for Spring Arbor.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:45

And I said, well, to go to the national tournament next year.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:48

And they all started laughing at me.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:50

And I was kind of, like, taken aback, but I said, well, we're going to have to change the culture, the mindset, the work ethic, and completely revamp everything.

Doug Knoll: 00:15:59

We got to get some better players.

Doug Knoll: 00:16:01

And I started out with Jim Linhart, who played at South Adams, and we ended up the first year winning 18 games and came within 21 seconds going to the national tournament.

Doug Knoll: 00:16:12

So, you know, those goals pushed me through Spring Arbor to where we were number two and number four in the country from that standpoint.

Doug Knoll: 00:16:19

But it was my fifth, fourth year at Spring Arbor.

Doug Knoll: 00:16:25

I had job interviews at Grand Valley State and also Indiana, Purdue, Fort Wayne, and obviously, I'm from the Fort Wayne area, burns about 30 miles south.

Doug Knoll: 00:16:37

But I came down, and you were going to be a sophomore in high school and talked to coach Robert Irwin, who used to come to Lancer basketball camp when he was little.

Doug Knoll: 00:16:47

We ended up talking about coming to Carroll High School, but for Some reason, I was offered the job at IPFW, and it just.

Doug Knoll: 00:16:57

,: 1996

Doug Knoll: 00:17:04

And I remember driving back to Spring Arbor and talking to Butch Perchand, who was the athletic director at the time, and just.

Doug Knoll: 00:17:11

I said, it's not the right time.

Doug Knoll: 00:17:13

And so we stayed for another three years, and you got to finish your high school career at Jackson County Western.

Doug Knoll: 00:17:20

And then IPFW called back again three years later, and you'd already signed and committed with Spring Arbor University.

Doug Knoll: 00:17:28

So there's a whole nother story there, if you want to go down that path.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:32

Sure, yeah.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:33

And I had a.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:34

I played varsity as a freshman.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:36

As a, you know, smaller school.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:38

It was.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:39

It wasn't the smallest, but it was in a really good conference and had a.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:43

Had a pretty solid freshman season, you know, But I don't know.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:47

I think I go back to a comment that when we moved from Bern to Warsaw, you know, I was young enough.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:52

I didn't know what was going on.

Brad Knoll: 00:17:54

And then, as I was, you know, in elementary school in Warsaw, we were going to move again.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:00

And so I just.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:01

I always remember saying to you, it's like, well, I didn't want to move to Warsaw, and it was great.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:06

And so I don't want to move to Michigan.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:08

So I guess it's probably going to be even better, you know, and I got to have an open mind.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:11

And so we took that open mind up to Michigan.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:13

But, you know, yeah, I ended up.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:15

Was able to play all four years at a high school.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:18

I had a pretty successful high school career, first team, all state a couple times and scored a lot of points.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:23

But.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:24

But I think for me, the thing that I've learned is, you know, there's always opportunity on the other side of your.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:29

Of your comfort zone.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:31

And if you're hearing this right now and you're thinking about something that's uncomfortable, whether it's growing personally or in your job or professionally, I think.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:39

I think there's a lot of beauty on the other side of your comfort zone.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:43

It doesn't feel good going through it.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:45

And, you know, I think our life is like that.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:47

And then.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:48

And then IPFW called again, and I think that was.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:51

I was a student of the game at an early age, before I knew what being a student of the game was.

Brad Knoll: 00:18:56

And it's because of, you know, all the sayings and the quotes that I've heard over the years.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:00

You know, the one that sticks out the Most is when you.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:03

When you say there's more to life than basketball.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:04

But through basketball, you can learn many lessons about life, and that's.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:07

That's kind of the definition of student at the game, like, whatever game you're playing.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:13

For us, for our family, it was basketball, and we learned a lot about life.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:15

I say this podcast was birthed because I have a master's degree in business.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:19

From the locker room, whatever you're going through in life, you can.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:22

You can learn from it.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:23

It has clues, if you pick up those clues, and I think you use those clues to follow your passion.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:28

And, you know, I remember, you know, the conversation of, hey, you've committed to Spring Arbor.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:32

I want to play for my dad.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:34

You know, I was recruited.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:35

There were some Division 1 schools recruiting me, not a lot of smaller schools were recruiting me because they probably figured if I was going to go to NAI school, I'd play for.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:41

My dad got recruited Division 1, and I just kind of made a decision early, and I said, I'll never get this chance again.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:48

You know, I'll never get this opportunity again.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:50

So let's.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:51

Let's try it.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:52

And then you came back, you know, after my senior year, I remember we lost the first game in the playoffs in high school.

Brad Knoll: 00:19:57

We got upset, and you just kind of said, hey, what do you think about this?

Brad Knoll: 00:20:03

And I just said, hey, let's try it.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:05

So, yeah, I think I waited till your season was done, but they had called back, and Doc Skelton, who was hall of Famer at Purdue, Fort Wayne now, called me back, and I actually turned them down again.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:19

And then he called and said, doug, you really need to take a look at this, because you're from the area and your son can play here.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:26

It's great.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:28

We're thinking we're going Division one.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:30

So I remember asking you, and your first thought was, I don't think so.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:36

And then we talked a little bit more, and I said, well, let's just go look.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:40

And then you decide where you want to go to college, and I'll coach you there.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:44

And that was really an out for me to let you decide, not me.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:49

And if I decided and it turned out wrong, then it would have been on me.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:53

So I was kind of like, you go down, let's look.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:57

You decide where you want to go to college, and then I'll coach you there.

Doug Knoll: 00:20:59

And it ended up at IPFW.

Doug Knoll: 00:21:02

And so it was a start of Division 2 and then transitioned into Division 1.

Doug Knoll: 00:21:09

And it was not easy by any stretch of the Imagination.

Doug Knoll: 00:21:14

But again, we built a foundation for John Kaufman and Purdue Fort Wayne.

Doug Knoll: 00:21:19

I was just out there yesterday watching practice, talking to John and, and I'm proud of what they're doing right now at the university and also the men's basketball and other programs out there as well.

Doug Knoll: 00:21:30

But at proud that we, we got everything started Division one.

Brad Knoll: 00:21:35

Well, I think for me, when I think about that and yeah, PFW is an amazing program right now.

Brad Knoll: 00:21:40

If you're in Fort Wayne and you want to see a great brand of basketball, head over to the Coliseum.

Brad Knoll: 00:21:43

Watch, watch the men's and the women's programs.

Brad Knoll: 00:21:47

They're both phenomenal.

Brad Knoll: 00:21:48

So the coaches are doing a great job.

Brad Knoll: 00:21:52

Student of the Game is brought to you by Noel Team Real Estate.

Brad Knoll: 00:21:55

Our mission is to eradicate mediocre real estate transactions.

Brad Knoll: 00:21:59

On your largest financial purchase, you shouldn't have to deal with average.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:04

We do this by helping you save time, reduce your stress and helping you keep as much money in your pocket as we can.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:11

You can help us out by introducing us to your friends or family who want to make competent real estate decisions, whether buying, selling, building or investing.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:20

At Nolteam Real Estate, we are connected to a group of realtors who sell one in every eight homes in North America.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:27

If you know someone moving out of your area, there's a great chance we can connect them to somebody we know like and trust.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:34

Remember, relationships win.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:36

Now back to the what you're going through right now.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:40

What, what you, the listener are going through right now.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:43

I hope you understand it's not in vain because it was a challenge like to say taking that program from Division 2 to Division 1, not being in a conference, you know, always playing these guaranteed games where you're getting paid money but you're getting your, your head knocked in every single night.

Brad Knoll: 00:22:59

You know, you maybe have a chance to win, but probably not and understand there's a bigger purpose.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:05

Like I look back now and I say we helped start that.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:09

It's not where it is today without us starting it.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:11

And we didn't enjoy going through it, but we are now enjoying the fruits of the labor.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:16

And so I was just telling Delaney the other night, like, you know, you have to understand that there are you were that little girl going to the basketball games and wanting to be that girl.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:26

Now there are little girls coming to your game tonight and they want to be you.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:30

That's a responsibility that you have to do something with.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:33

If you're leading a team, if you're a leader, a manager, if you lead people, which is Everybody.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:37

There are people who want to be in your position and you feel bad for the position you're in.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:42

There are people who wish they had your life.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:44

And so I think that's important to understand too is, you know, in business you're not just building it for you and for what you're getting, like there's, there's a bigger purpose.

Brad Knoll: 00:23:53

And when you work for that bigger purpose, there's, there's a, I think, a deep level of appreciation for what you're going through.

Brad Knoll: 00:24:00

I have it now.

Brad Knoll: 00:24:01

I maybe didn't as much.

Brad Knoll: 00:24:03

So tell us a little bit about, you know, that journey through Division 1.

Brad Knoll: 00:24:06

And then I think the climax of this story ends in a different direction.

Brad Knoll: 00:24:11

But walk us through that.

Doug Knoll: 00:24:13

Yeah, we, when we transitioned, you know, it was kind of a lot of, a lot of excitement in the community.

Doug Knoll: 00:24:19

And you know, we had Oregon State coming in and we started off with Morehead State and it was a process and we were competitive, I can say that.

Doug Knoll: 00:24:30

We didn't win a lot of games, but we were competitive.

Doug Knoll: 00:24:33

But, you know, as we went longer and longer, we became what I would consider the cash cow of the university.

Doug Knoll: 00:24:41

And our chancellor didn't even know that we could play basketball games and get paid for them.

Doug Knoll: 00:24:46

So I kind of told him that, and maybe I shouldn't have because then he started wanting more and more guarantee games.

Doug Knoll: 00:24:52

To give you an example, today, like Purdue, Fort Wayne may play three guarantee games a year, and right now they'll get over probably $100,000 per game.

Doug Knoll: 00:25:05

Back when we started, we were getting 30, $35,000 a game.

Doug Knoll: 00:25:09

And I think we ended up in our biggest year playing 15 guarantee games.

Doug Knoll: 00:25:13

Now what that means is we're playing high end universities, power conference, fives, Notre Dame, Michigan's, Michigan State, Purdue, Marquette, Iowa State, you know, we played them all.

Doug Knoll: 00:25:25

And that added up to a lot of losses too.

Doug Knoll: 00:25:28

And you know, it's, it gets difficult sometimes when you're in practices and you're explaining to the team, you know, what we need to do to win.

Doug Knoll: 00:25:37

And in the back of your mind you're like, yeah, I'm not sure, you know, we're going to win, but I've got to, I've got to continue to be positive and got to continue to have these players trust me as, as we move Forward through Division 1.

Doug Knoll: 00:25:51

And the biggest issue, and you know, and they're doing it right now, but the biggest issue was we were not in a conference when we started in Division one.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:01

And so you couldn't play conference games.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:05

You didn't have rivals.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:06

You know, IUPUI maybe was our only rival.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:10

And so.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:11

But as we went through it and I look back today, I don't remember a whole lot of the bad.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:17

I remember a lot of the good, the relationships that have been built, the players that I still stay in touch with.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:23

And going out to practice yesterday, Coach had him in a circle and called me over and introduced me to the team and because I was actually at Norfolk State last year in their very last game where they were playing in the coaches tournament at the end of the year for the championship and got beat, but I got to see the team there.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:44

So, you know, he said, if you guys don't know Coach Noel, he's the one that built this foundation and started the program 23 years ago in Division 1.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:54

So it's.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:54

It's come a.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:55

It's come a long way.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:56

But at the end of the day, we didn't.

Doug Knoll: 00:26:58

We didn't do the job we wanted to, but we did the best we could.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:02

Well, I think.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:04

I think it's important for.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:05

I'm going to speak to my team here for a second.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:07

So if everybody's listening, if you can just kind of know that I'm speaking directly to my team right now.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:12

I think there's a lot, a lot in your story that we can relate to.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:19

So you tell me.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:20

You went from top of the World, Spring Arbor, nationally ranked top five in the country year over year, playing for the national championship, like having that type of a caliber team.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:32

You had an unbelievable record and unbelievable success at Spring Arbor.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:36

And then you go to IPFW and we can't win any games.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:40

And I think that that feels a lot like the real estate market.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:43

When interest rates are 3%, everybody's buying.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:45

And when interest rates are at 7 or 8%, nobody's buying.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:47

And you have to ask yourself, is it because I'm a bad realtor?

Brad Knoll: 00:27:51

Like, did you ever say, am I a bad coach?

Brad Knoll: 00:27:54

Right.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:54

I mean, you got put in a situation that hardly anybody could have had success in.

Brad Knoll: 00:27:59

And I think what we have to do is we have to find those clues that show us, like, hey, the environment we're in doesn't make us good or bad.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:08

Right?

Brad Knoll: 00:28:09

I mean, you had success at Spring Arbor.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:10

And the fact that we couldn't transition that over to IPFW doesn't necessarily say how you were as a coach.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:17

And so in this real estate environment, if you're in an industry right now that is a little challenging, you've got to ask yourself, okay, how do you win in this environment?

Brad Knoll: 00:28:25

And I think you have to start peeling that back a little bit.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:27

How do you win in this environment?

Brad Knoll: 00:28:29

And I think what I see is there's so many similarities to coaching as there is to running a business.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:37

And I just, I want to give you credit because I think you were.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:40

You were set up to fail.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:41

It was a very tough position, but I think you handled it well.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:44

And the best part of it is the connection you have with the program now, knowing that, you know, they are.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:50

They are appreciating you.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:51

You know, they're elevating you as kind of like that, you know, you're the Mount Rushmore of ipfw.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:56

You know, I.

Brad Knoll: 00:28:57

The one that got it started and somebody else had to take it over and make it better.

Brad Knoll: 00:29:01

And now there's more tools and there's more resources, and that's great.

Brad Knoll: 00:29:04

And I don't think that there's any bitterness from that, but.

Brad Knoll: 00:29:07

So then walk me through.

Brad Knoll: 00:29:09

You had a famous saying that says, you know, coaches either get fired or they retire.

Brad Knoll: 00:29:13

You know, one of the two.

Brad Knoll: 00:29:15

You usually don't just set off into the sunset, you know, very easily.

Brad Knoll: 00:29:18

So walk us through what happened when, when you got let go.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:21

Yeah, the coaches usually get fired or they're going to be fired down the road, but including the great Bob Knight from Indiana.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:29

So, you know, we.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:32

We struggled, but we won some games.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:34

We were competitive.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:35

I remember going to Purdue and playing against coach Dean, Katie, and, you know, we were kind of the stepsister school and we went down to their tournament and ended up.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:47

We had an Indiana all star.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:48

We had Dave Simon, our center, who was ranked the second best center in the country behind the Mickey.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:53

OK, for review con, and we're down one at half and we lose by 11.

Doug Knoll: 00:29:58

And Gene came up to me and said a couple words like, if you play like that the rest of the year, Doug, you'll never get beat.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:04

And he said a couple other words in there that I don't want to say on the podcast.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:09

But.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:10

But I said, whatever, Gene, you know, but thanks for having us.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:14

And.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:14

And we were competitive, but on the long run, we.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:18

We just got wore down.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:19

It just.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:20

It just took a toll on myself and my staff.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:23

And so in January, I think in my sixth season, I got called in the office and remember the day, remember everything.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:32

And they said, you know, you're going to be fired.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:36

And kind of just numbing.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:38

I just was like, in some ways it was a relief.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:43

Other ways, it.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:44

It really, really hurt.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:47

And I didn't know really quite what to do.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:49

I went home and I was home by myself, just kind of looking at four walls, wondering what was going to happen next and everything.

Doug Knoll: 00:30:56

And all of a sudden I started getting a lot of calls from other coaches and actually had some offers, you know, to coach other programs.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:05

The following year I had a press conference and Mark Pope, at the time my athletic director, who I'm very good friends with, you know, asked me what I was going to do and I said, it's just my time to thank everybody in Fort Wayne and especially the university for giving me the opportunity.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:20

We didn't get there.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:21

We didn't finish what we started.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:24

But I wanted to thank the media.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:26

I wanted to thank all the people that have, you know, stuck with us.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:29

And so I did that and then just kind of didn't know what to do for a while.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:35

But I had a lot of opportunity to go into coaching.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:40

But your sister, Abby Grubbs now was in her third year at Bethel College.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:49

And I really gave it a lot of thought.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:52

But it's like, you know, I got to see you every day in practice, I got to see you play every game for four years, but I didn't get to see Abby a lot.

Doug Knoll: 00:31:59

And so if I went into coaching and had to move to Texas or something, I just didn't feel like that was a good move for me at the time and the family.

Doug Knoll: 00:32:07

And so I decided not to go into coaching but to stay in Fort Wayne.

Doug Knoll: 00:32:14

And I got to see Abby play the last couple years of her career where she became the all time leading scorer at Bethel College for at least one year and they went to the national tournament.

Doug Knoll: 00:32:25

So it was really a good, it was really a good decision.

Doug Knoll: 00:32:28

A part of that, Brad, I can tell you, is there, there's always ups and downs in life and there's two things that can happen.

Doug Knoll: 00:32:36

One, you can get bitter about the whole thing.

Doug Knoll: 00:32:40

And if you're bitter and upset and angry, the people you're bitter and upset and angry at, they don't know that it's just you carrying on sight.

Doug Knoll: 00:32:47

The other part is you can get better and you can move on and chalk it up to experience with all the kids that I, you know, been able to coach, all the people that I knew in Fort Wayne.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:00

And to this day I can walk back to a ball game like we did the other night and see eight to 10 people that, that I've had relationships with and chat with them.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:11

Tonight, I'm sure the Homestead game, I'm going to see a lot of People.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:14

And there's a lot of people coming out that know me, that are coming out to the game to see Delaney play because, you know, relationships I have with them.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:22

So, you know, I always look at it that, you know, it's.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:27

It's.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:28

There's always going to be struggles in life, and you're always going to have ups and downs.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:32

But the biggest thing is, you know, you just got to keep moving forward and, you know, learn from situations and mistakes, but don't carry them with you.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:42

You know, just continue to be positive and be a.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:45

Be a shining light.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:47

I.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:47

I like the golden rule.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:49

That's how I grew up.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:50

I want to treat people like I want to be treated.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:53

I want to be kind.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:54

And so, you know, I moved on from that, stayed in Fort Wayne.

Doug Knoll: 00:33:58

It was difficult for a while, but after the fact that, you know, you look back now and you're proud of the program that they have out there at Purdue, Fort Wayne.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:06

Yeah, no, it's.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:08

Thanks for sharing that.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:09

I don't know many people that are willing to just jump on a podcast and talking about the time that they got fired because it's humbling, you know, and probably humiliating, but.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:17

But humbling at the same time.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:18

And I.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:18

I have a lot of respect for.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:19

For you and for many coaches that are out there, because what the.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:22

What the general public doesn't understand is the news does not follow you to work.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:28

You know, I mean, picture this picture.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:31

You know, it's a.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:32

It's a Wednesday.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:33

You're listening to this podcast on a Wednesday.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:34

I don't know when you're listening to this podcast, but whatever day you're listening to this podcast, act like the news is going to come to your work today, and they're going to report how you did tomorrow to everybody.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:44

I mean, that's essentially the life that you lived, is they gave you a grade every single time you went to work.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:51

You know, is your team ready for the preseason?

Brad Knoll: 00:34:52

Did you recruit well?

Brad Knoll: 00:34:53

How's your recruiting class?

Brad Knoll: 00:34:54

Did you play well?

Brad Knoll: 00:34:55

Did you win?

Brad Knoll: 00:34:56

Did you lose?

Brad Knoll: 00:34:56

You know, that happened every single day.

Brad Knoll: 00:34:59

And so that's.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:00

That's the life that I grew up watching.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:02

I watched, you know, my dad in the spotlight of people critiquing him at work every single day.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:08

And so I think that that kind of built some resiliency in me, that built some mental toughness to say, okay, if that's.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:14

If that's how you're going to be, you know, critiqued every day, then I need to go to work.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:18

You know, just like, they're watching me, too.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:20

And so thanks for sharing about the firing.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:23

What's crazy, I don't think you shared with the listeners is your last game coaching was against Wyoming, which is where you played for a year.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:32

And the athletic department asked you to get one more game that year, and that's the game that you went and got for them so that they can make some more money.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:38

Not about them.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:39

Right.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:39

There's.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:40

There's no ill feelings there.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:42

But it's ironic, the irony of you played at Wyoming, you got that extra game, and then that was your last game coaching.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:49

So thanks, thanks for sharing about that because like I said, I think people can see their own, their own selves, their own story in that story.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:57

So we talk about.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:58

We're going a little rogue today.

Brad Knoll: 00:35:59

I got my dad on the podcast, if you don't know this.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:01

And we usually talk about mastering the fundamentals, we talk about falling in love with practice and winning at the game of life.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:08

And we could probably do an hour podcast may have you back as a guest again and, you know, get through some story time.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:14

But winning at the game of life, this is something that I actually gotta share something real quick.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:20

So after you got fired, you had a basketball academy.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:23

You gave lessons to kids.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:24

You were one of the premier places where kids in our area came for lessons for basketball training.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:30

Now there's a bunch of options and there's a lot of really good options, but you're kind of at the forefront of that.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:35

We'll.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:35

We'll skip over that.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:36

But then one day, I remember just sitting and talking to you.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:39

I'm like, man, you should get your real estate license.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:41

You're like, what?

Brad Knoll: 00:36:42

No, I already did that in the 80s.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:43

I said, hey, again, interest rates are not 18%.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:46

Okay, I get your real estate license.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:50

You know everybody in Fort Wayne.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:51

And at that time, I was.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:53

I just started building a team and I said, we'll take care of everything.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:55

You just got to go meet people and help.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:57

Help people buy and sell homes.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:58

We'll take.

Brad Knoll: 00:36:58

Take care of everything else.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:00

I remember this story.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:01

I don't.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:01

It's been a while since I've shared this with you, but so technically, like, this isn't how we were.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:06

Like, I'm the leader of Noel Team Real Estate.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:09

Okay?

Brad Knoll: 00:37:09

I don't look at myself as the boss, but for the sake of the drill, let's just say I'm the boss at Noel Team Real Estate.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:15

I remember I played for you, and as much joy as I got from it, it was miserable Playing for you physically.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:25

Like more sprints, more running, more training.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:28

Right.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:28

And you put me through the wringer, and now I get to be your boss.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:33

And I'm like, this is going to be amazing.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:34

I can't wait to make him run a karma.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:36

Yeah.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:37

But I remember.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:38

I remember going to lunch one day with you, and I think it was the summer.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:40

It was hot.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:40

I had some shorts on.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:42

You know, we went and got some sushi or something.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:43

And I.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:44

I remember one of your buddies coming in, and he looked at me.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:48

I could tell he was eyeing me up and down, wearing my shorts.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:51

And he looked at me and said, your boss lets you wear shorts to work.

Brad Knoll: 00:37:55

And I didn't have the heart to tell him who was the boss at that point, but I let that one slide.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:02

But it was a lot of fun having you on our real estate team, and you had a lot of success in that.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:06

Because I think this is the theme I want the whole entire podcast to know is everybody needs a coach.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:13

Everybody needs a coach.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:14

And you being an actual coach, you coached people in their real estate decisions.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:21

You coached buyers, make great decisions.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:23

You coached sellers.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:24

I remember there was nobody better on our team that when a seller was getting ready to put their home on the market, I remember you getting listings because you were the one that was honest with somebody and says, you need new mulch, you need fresh mulch.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:34

You need to clean your landscaping up.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:35

You need to do this to your house.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:37

You were coaching buyers and sellers in their transactions, and you were giving them advice.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:42

And it's something that you may not have intentionally done, but that's just who you are, right?

Brad Knoll: 00:38:46

I mean, you coach.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:48

And so you've got this hashtag, now call the coach.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:50

And that's.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:51

That's.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:51

That's your big thing.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:53

Tell people what you're doing.

Doug Knoll: 00:38:54

Now.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:54

You are the national.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:57

National sales director.

Brad Knoll: 00:38:58

And before we hit record, we just kind of had a little moment here, and we said, you know, isn't it ironic?

Brad Knoll: 00:39:04

I'm going to keep using the word ironic or irony.

Brad Knoll: 00:39:06

There's irony in knowing that you left a career to go coach, and it's a career that you ended up getting fired from.

Brad Knoll: 00:39:15

And you now being out of basketball, are coaching more people than you did when you were there.

Brad Knoll: 00:39:22

You're still coaching.

Brad Knoll: 00:39:23

Call the coach.

Brad Knoll: 00:39:24

What are you doing now?

Doug Knoll: 00:39:26

in real estate again back in: 2009

Doug Knoll: 00:39:33

And I'm like, you mean I have to go take tests and go to school again?

Doug Knoll: 00:39:36

And so I did, and I Passed my real estate exam and had a great time working with you and the Knoll team and.

Doug Knoll: 00:39:46

And then had a shift in life and ended up moving to Pinehurst, North Carolina, almost six and a half years ago.

Doug Knoll: 00:39:56

But while I was here with the Knoll team, I used a warranty company called Home Warranty Incorporated, and kind of funny name for a home warranty company, but I guess that's all they could come up with.

Doug Knoll: 00:40:05

So, you know, home warranty, you need a home warranty with Home Warranty Incorporated.

Doug Knoll: 00:40:12

So I used that home warranty for probably six, seven years while I was in Fort Wayne.

Doug Knoll: 00:40:18

And a good friend of mine who was the sales rep at the time, Scott Kellenberger, reached out when I had moved to North Carolina, and I also got my real estate license in North Carolina.

Doug Knoll: 00:40:28

So I had it in Indiana and North Carolina, and Rhonda did too.

Doug Knoll: 00:40:33

And then Home Orte reached out and said, listen, we need somebody in Virginia, North Carolina, and we think you fit the bill.

Doug Knoll: 00:40:40

You're a broker, and you've used our company for quite a while.

Doug Knoll: 00:40:44

So about five years ago, I jumped in my car and started driving all over, trying to, you know, sell home warranties.

Doug Knoll: 00:40:52

But more so, I used my real estate background as a broker to really assist other realtors and other brokers because I had the experience and that I was able to get to their level to talk to them about why home warranties are important, not just pitch.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:12

Pitch home warranties, because I actually sat on their side of the desk.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:15

So I did that for four and a half years, and I had great territory.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:19

I mean, went to the Outer Banks, Virginia beach, all over, down the coast.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:23

It was.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:24

It was.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:24

I really enjoyed it.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:25

And then our company was bought out a few years back by a Fortune 200 company out of Florida.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:32

My boss, Jane, ended up becoming CEO for our company, and she hired me as the national sales director, overseeing a team of about 27 sales reps.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:43

And because of my real estate and coaching background, she thought that would really be, you know, exciting.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:50

And while their home warranty companies right now are, you know, pulling people off the road and downsizing, we are.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:56

We actually have given about.

Doug Knoll: 00:41:59

We've had six new positions, I should say, this year for sales reps.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:04

So we're actually growing exponentially as we move, and we're a national company now.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:09

So I've been doing that for not quite two years as the national sales director.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:15

I don't deal with realtors per se anymore, but I deal with our sales reps.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:20

We just came off our team Your team.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:22

Exactly.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:23

I'm coaching them, trying to coach them up.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:26

You know, we've got, We.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:29

We do it kind of like a football team where I've got seven coaches that are probably have 80 years experience, all told, with Home Warranty Incorporated, and they coach a couple people in their pod and talk to them each week.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:44

And then once a month, they get together with their team of three, maybe four.

Doug Knoll: 00:42:49

ransactions last year than in: 1993

Doug Knoll: 00:43:05

30 years.

Doug Knoll: 00:43:06

So, you know, there's, there's, there's things that are tough in our business, too, but, you know, you just keep fighting through and trying to be the best we can be at what we do.

Doug Knoll: 00:43:17

And so I get a lot of joy in that.

Doug Knoll: 00:43:19

You know, people look at me, why aren't you retired?

Doug Knoll: 00:43:22

And it's like, I've never seen that word in the Bible.

Doug Knoll: 00:43:24

So I guess I just keep on going.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:26

You were, if my memory serves me right, you were rookie of the year in your 60s at home warranty Inc.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:31

Like this Rookie of the year, you know, how about that?

Doug Knoll: 00:43:34

At 65.

Doug Knoll: 00:43:35

Right?

Doug Knoll: 00:43:36

So.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:37

Well, I want to do something real quick.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:39

I think I could turn this in another episode, and I think we should.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:42

That'd be a lot of fun.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:42

We could go back and talk about stories.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:44

But I want.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:45

I want people to hear the perseverance, you know, I want people to hear chasing your passions.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:49

I want people to hear, you know, your resiliency, you know, and I guess publicly I want to thank you for, you know, my childhood and growing up the way that I did.

Brad Knoll: 00:43:58

I wasn't always grateful for it at the time when you were coaching me up about cleaning my room, but, you know, I'm proud of it.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:05

And I think you've been through.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:08

You've been through things, and we didn't even talk about you coaching overseas and doing camps and you and mom setting up, you know, Cougar basketball camp, and you're making money off the concession stands like.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:17

Like you literally were resourceful and doing so much.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:21

And so one of the things is in our podcast, we talk about master the fundamentals, falling in love with practice and winning at the game of life.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:28

And I think you've taken that outlook of whatever I'm going through is going to make me better, and you just kept chasing that.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:37

So on this podcast, we believe relationships win.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:41

And I think, you know, I'm the founder of Creating relationships win.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:45

But I think I have to say you inspired me for that.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:48

And so relationships do win.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:50

And so my kids are like, hey, give this man his flowers.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:53

Send.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:54

Send him some flowers.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:55

And we believe relationships win.

Brad Knoll: 00:44:57

And so who do you think is somebody that, you know, you want to give some flowers out that's really helped you maybe, you know, see life the way you have.

Brad Knoll: 00:45:05

Like, you're optimistic, you just.

Brad Knoll: 00:45:07

You move on, you chase your passions.

Brad Knoll: 00:45:10

Who do you want to give some flowers out that's helped you along the way?

Doug Knoll: 00:45:13

Well, I think, and this might sound a little corny, but I would like to give you some flowers because, you know, I've watched you grow your business for 20 years, and I've learned a lot from you, which I think is kind of strange, but not if you grew up in our household, you know, the competitiveness that we have.

Doug Knoll: 00:45:36

And, you know, so I try to learn from everyone.

Doug Knoll: 00:45:42

And, you know, I've watched you grow your business and work with your team as well, and I think that's.

Doug Knoll: 00:45:49

I'm very proud of that.

Doug Knoll: 00:45:50

As I've always said, despite their parents, our kids turned out really well.

Doug Knoll: 00:45:55

And that goes by saying, but I'd also like to give Rhonda some flowers.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:00

You know, she's been great.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:02

She's gone down to Pinehurst, and I remember when I asked her, we were.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:06

We were going down three or four times a year, and one day I said, you ever think about moving there?

Doug Knoll: 00:46:11

And she's like, yeah, you'd leave your kids and grandkids?

Doug Knoll: 00:46:13

And I said, yeah, then come visit.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:15

You know, they might like to play golf, too.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:17

So.

Brad Knoll: 00:46:19

And now we do.

Brad Knoll: 00:46:20

Now we got a golfer who came down to play.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:21

Now.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:22

There you go.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:22

So, you know, those are there, too.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:25

But your family as well has been great.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:27

And I'm here this weekend just because I'm a proud grandpa.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:31

And, you know, I get.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:33

I got to watch my granddaughter play golf, and now I got the middle granddaughter, get to watch her play basketball.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:39

So it's a family thing, but it's really important and, you know, family first.

Doug Knoll: 00:46:45

And so that's been great.

Brad Knoll: 00:46:47

Well, I appreciate you coming on.

Brad Knoll: 00:46:49

I wanted to introduce my audience to the founder, the original, the OG Student of the game.

Brad Knoll: 00:46:55

You know, I've learned a lot and appreciate you getting on here.

Brad Knoll: 00:46:59

Hopefully, you, the listener, you've learned something today.

Brad Knoll: 00:47:01

You heard kind of my story through my dad and his eyes and what he's been through and what he's accomplished and what he's overcome.

Brad Knoll: 00:47:07

And if I can just share the message of hope and the message of pursue your passions, the money will follow you and just keep focusing on those fundamentals.

Brad Knoll: 00:47:20

Fall in love with practice and eventually you're going to win at the game of life.

Doug Knoll: 00:47:23

Hey Brant.

Brad Knoll: 00:47:24

Dad, thanks for being on the podcast.

Doug Knoll: 00:47:26

Yeah, and the last thing is above my real estate desk.

Doug Knoll: 00:47:29

When I was working for you, I had this saying, problems are the price of progress.

Doug Knoll: 00:47:33

And so whenever you have a problem you can't sweep it under the rug.

Doug Knoll: 00:47:36

You got to take it on full board straight ahead and take care of the problems and, and just keep moving forward in life.

Brad Knoll: 00:47:44

That's awesome.

Doug Knoll: 00:47:45

Thanks for having me.

Brad Knoll: 00:47:46

Hey, relationships win and, and I know I'm winning with this relationship, so thanks dad.

Doug Knoll: 00:47:51

Thanks.

Brad Knoll: 00:47:54

Thanks for listening to student of the Game podcast.

Brad Knoll: 00:47:56

Whatever game you are playing, I'm cheering for you.

Brad Knoll: 00:48:00

See you in the next class.